#011 Mindset, Public Speaking And Diversity With Enna Khan Transcript
Please note the following transcript will contain errors as it is automated and is not always accurate but you will get the gist!
hi I’m Suzana Kalcic and you’re listening to life in practice podcast I’m curious about the big questions in life and how we can experience more meaning and fulfillment every day join me as my guests share their challenges successes and what it means to put our purpose our bodies and our lives in practice hello and welcome to the life and practice podcast This Is Your host Suzana and today my guest is Enna Khan she’s a customer experience experts and a public speaking coach welcome Enna thank you sees a having me I’m and she’s a good friend of mine as well so I’m I’m really excited to have you on here today and we actually met although I this is how we connected was three our shared public speaking journey and %HESITATION we both met at the same %HESITATION the same at Toastmasters club and %HESITATION yeah maybe let’s let’s just start there how did you how did you end up there because you know you’re you seem like very like confident like full on but it wasn’t actually wasn’t actually always all like that was it nine not still %HESITATION say taste must as wall is actually not a patent experience for me it was because I had done a presentation in a new role with my boss and during the presentation I just felt so nervous and anxious at the thought of doing really well and off to the presentation my boss said to me he did pull me aside he said to me %HESITATION you know you’re already good to present some that I think you could do really well if you went to Tyson lost as and he’d been impressed in his local club in Islington and he was it is a good presenter and I’ve seen that you know the confidence that he has a thought what if he thinks it’s good he’s been a president I trust his decisions so why don’t I try it and I think he tried to get a few of the %HESITATION colleagues into Toastmasters and they’d go on and they fill well it’s not right for them but I when did she die and I loved it so it’s just this little community that you know a CZ if really friendly people support save any foe any safe and yeah I just R. S. puppet is very much a life changing experience for me mmhm yeah yeah same for me I can definitely agree with that I am so can you take me back a bit %HESITATION because you went there %HESITATION initially because he had a social anxiety %HESITATION can you talk to me a bit about that yeah of course I can so you going to tase masters I didn’t realize that the club itself was a cop that was specializing in people he you hat you know stomatal social anxiety in going to the cop lots of people were saying that I had social anxiety and sharing their experiences of being C. penned up S. not able to speak in a scattered minds and thoughts when they were off to speaking from today %HESITATION so then I realized actually the feeding so I’ve been having a feeling isolated feeling like I don’t have a voice fading lock icon B. myself was all connected to what was going on in my head around this anxiety and yes it happens a lot in social settings seven settings where I wasn’t familiar with the people I was speaking to it may have been a social setting %HESITATION you know we say social anxiety batch date wasn’t just a social settings it was being in professional settings as well say people who may have been most senior than me people who I really respected that opinion off I thought this super intelligent I don’t wanna make myself that stupid in front of them %HESITATION you know even that sometimes being you know an event a new relationship at that time thinking actually what does this person think if me and feeling like I need to say things in everyday confident structured way that make it makes me look like I know I’m talking about say the link between me getting to Toastmasters and what was going on in my head was just super timely it just was right for me at that time and then %HESITATION the kind of the kind of practice that ties most disease exposure isn’t it you keep on practicing practicing practicing he hired in on well every stopping you from communicating and you do that with people that are experiencing the same things as you and then you get better asset so you for me to social anxiety plays a massive paw in stopping me from achieving things I wanted to do later on in life %HESITATION and you know I’ve spoken about this it wasn’t something that I’ve always suffered from you know and I have been super confident my whole life great day %HESITATION and that might be because you know I’ve got an older sister on the younger cheeky sibling you know I get away with it all things but then when I turned thirty five mid thirties you know it everything changed ended a long time relationship new job new relationship new high you know a new set of people that I wouldn’t I was meeting at the time suddenly all of these changes hit me at one guy and I it was then like %HESITATION what do I do thank who am I what do I stand full what do I want to %HESITATION to really achieve UHC and I’m not saying it was I I I don’t know what I’m doing kind of thing in my head I was in town and I sing along with the schools that were %HESITATION we don’t get enough you know professor chief ace thank I. for even you don’t even try I’m not sweating Toastmasters was the place to help me but we will say spoken about being in an environment that you have the sacking of people who all you’ll support network B. dot you’ll working relationships your boss your colleagues who are massive supports %HESITATION the family of the state massive support and then you’ll you’ll partner you know you’ve got to be in in June with the Opana focused on the same if well we don’t have to be focused on the same things that stay focused on the same goal is superimpose and I think yeah and I think %HESITATION what’s %HESITATION interesting about your story is that %HESITATION you’ve experienced this kind of loss of confidence and anxiety out today %HESITATION later H. because %HESITATION because most people tend to be a kind of covering things like from their childhood or they had more difficult experiences growing up so it’s really interesting to hear that actually you know it can happen M. when you are older yeah definitely I think the %HESITATION you know mental health we are affected every day every day by what’s going on in our head by what’s happening in our surroundings and it can be just a flick of a switch something happens where one day you’ll see a competent and the next day you’re like all you can swear my life I’m not I’m not super confident I’m not the person who he I have been in the past and it’s just what plays in your head stays in town %HESITATION messages that you have play out in reality so when did you kind of realize that your like a self talk or hear mindset started to kind of take you downwards you know because you know because we spoke or they’re not you know you’re you’re right really confident and I got the age of twenty seven you’re ready at the head of a %HESITATION off a department in your workplace %HESITATION so you seem to be like on a real strong %HESITATION %HESITATION huh really strong upwards at trade trade trip transaction rate and then %HESITATION how did how did those thoughts start to go to that creep in for you the end maybe you don’t have what it takes or maybe this is not because I imagine like maybe it’s kind of was it like a slow process for you or was it just like one day it was just you know it was kind of all at all %HESITATION at Hey you out one yeah I think the lastly I think where it’s coming from is from a place of wanting to achieve mobile because if I was happy staying the same price then I would be happy being same pass internal evolving so I think the the the kind of expectations I have of what I want to J. E. for me and my family is not all I not where I am if that makes sense like I always want to do a betta and my partner have conversations about this all the time well it’s all fashion of success in his fashion of success is different to mine in terms of you know we all in there okay place at the moment but actually I won you know a more things and and he wants more things but we kind of feel like I I I would be a kind of having a flashing called he would be right now okay %HESITATION so we kind of meet halfway in in the mid %HESITATION and determined by all means of coals %HESITATION so you so fast is what is someone’s definition of success and all they happy to stay in the same price that may have stayed in the past and if they’re not happy to stay in the same price which is what happened to me then you have to challenge yourself with what you what you do how you behave as a pass and what you can achieve and and therefore if you’re not in a place where you think actually I can achieve what I want to achieve you then I think all how do I get to that place in a lot of times people don’t know how to get to that place and that’s why I think with me it started to internalize of I’m not good enough I can’t do this you know there were people all around me here well achieving things in my mind and I’m not all law why not all say this whole journey hasn’t been I cannot even night and realization that yes you know my communication mining so I’d say my confidence and needs to be changed it’s been a journey of repeat myself out that you know with Toastmasters going in C. Punjab S. being sowed the back %HESITATION to then you know apes working my way through the ranks at Tyson lost is because they’re all ranks in terms of levels and you know a skills that you can learn in the different roles I’m to to to then becoming a president of the club and you know a what really happened wells in my life in one whatever I was learning entice monsters over what we’re reading read a light so the more confident I call you know in one place I was getting more confident in the other place so it wasn’t like I was wearing a mosque it was just slowly bit by bit I was able to carry that little bit faster a four line I thought actually that’s really uncomfortable I don’t want to go over that line but I just kept on getting kept on going into the uncomfortable zone and exposing myself I guess to to being not meticulous because I’ve taken the people around me would say that but getting it wrong so you have to be willing to get it wrong to fail to then say actually I’ve learned that lesson you know next time I’m going to do it right there %HESITATION next time I’m gonna try this and yes some I felt at least at least I’ve tried and at least I I can say that I’ve been a %HESITATION and I think the everything in life you know at the moment I’m struggling to do exercise you know you’ve put on a bit of light you know because we’re eating all the time about high in the fifties just that you know Hey and say it’s like how do I get back into a healthy exercise and routine say why I’m really struggling to do that said bit by bit strike seven minutes to dive you know a a bit of exercise intensity spend fifteen minutes so the moment I met seven minutes it’s good this is a good start but I am yeah I just like %HESITATION when I hear you talk about %HESITATION this fading off you know you have your idea of what %HESITATION %HESITATION some successes and then you’re kind of always kind of %HESITATION like yearning for %HESITATION a certain point in life where to achieve a certain thing M. I. ends the issues that that that that that can have an effect on our %HESITATION the dental health center of this need to constantly improve to Tina always like reach this goal and not goal just wondering maybe %HESITATION if there is a %HESITATION violence between self acceptance but also kind of pushing yourself to achieve %HESITATION that next goal or or you know or whatever it is that you want to experience yeah there’s definitely a balance because I guess the to me what’s happened during cave it you realize what’s really important you know it’s family it’s experiences it’s memories it’s all of those really important things that when you get your death bed you’re not going to think all yes that brilliant a walk shoulder up brilliant you know I room in that house with that fantastic will pay but you’re not going to think of that you can think of your family your loved ones %HESITATION and the memories that you share with them say for me I think there is an absolute balance and you know I I guess for me I’ve always felt a responsibility towards my family and so in order to work really hard I then achieve certain things which enable me to do certain things with my family and so it’s a cycle of A. K. what I’m at work so you at your company see mom and dad or my sister or my nephew because I’m really working hard tonight but you’ve got to be outside and I’ve got to be outside actually in a wall there’s a line to this I’m going to walk away and this time is for my family %HESITATION so there was an absolute balance easy but it’s realizing that balance and I think that for a lot of people they will only get to a certain level of %HESITATION they will get to a certain level of success and then they’ll say I’m Hey I’m where I want to get to now I can take my ID I myself the the gas a little bit and enjoy it and that’s where we kind of all now all they would not what we want to pay what kind of right what’s the what’s the point of having you know a I don’t want to sound like I’m basting or anything but what was the point of having you know a property you money tied up in property when I actually think I would enjoy that money with your family or help your family to do things that I want to do as well %HESITATION and that’s where I’m out I cut all the enjoyed my enjoy wife chief now because when I’m sixty five I’m not gonna have people here might I thought I have in my life today the %HESITATION I can enjoy things with say it’s been a real game changer in times of my decisions on how I spend my time and spend you know a the success that it’s not masses of success it’s just my own success I’ve achieved in my life up until this point with my family I’m AT and that’s what’s important so I have to stick to my guns now because I’ve said it you know I said that I want to do the someone and you know I want to go and buy a house and today I want to you know I support my family you know I want to do certain things to get them to where they want to to get today I’m in order for them to be happy as well at but they have to do their own work to some extent we’re all responsible for our own happiness yeah we can’t we can’t put that responsibility on others yeah expect them to you know do everything for us yeah and we can’t do everything for them but we can definitely help we can definitely you know and this is the whole thing of you know if you look back container about your background you know team auch but my background will is %HESITATION you know a family came over to the U. K. in the in the seventies moms from the Philippines stats from cash maybe at Kashmir packs downsides I’m sorry they didn’t have anything when they came in the seventies United they basically what’s that Ross is off and didn’t really get anything out of that because the jobs that they what ten one you know highly paid jobs %HESITATION dot was head chef mom you know she was a mom and she had to look different job today admin jobs in a call center jobs type of thing %HESITATION say for me having an ability to support my family and to make sure that you know my nephew has things that I didn’t have that is important to me because I want to you know I want to make sure that well I’m not a single well I’m running is not just not just from a it’s essentially for for my family as well so M. would you say that %HESITATION that %HESITATION %HESITATION growing up a kind of in a %HESITATION working class environment that you know your parents came from different different countries and different cultures has not being kind of a driving force for you then to arrange %HESITATION yeah I would like to aim for high %HESITATION high success yes definitely sorry I as it you don’t really realize as as you grow up the kind of opportunities that you are I have had compatible dont %HESITATION you know English %HESITATION they they pay speaking English %HESITATION the moms very very good English does not say good English but you know I it’s English and he he can you know you have to define communicating with people %HESITATION what’s up I have had to the opportunities because I have been born head unit I understand certain things that they may not understand because I see things through the lens of big you know a someone who’s born and raised in in London you know a London in itself is a you know a west London you know it’s it’s it’s my kind of perspective that they wouldn’t have the national I’ve been able to to get things %HESITATION defect I haven’t been I had the opportunity to be exposed to a you know a I’m I’m not I’m I’m sure I haven’t had opportunities that other people have had the opportunity to be exposed to a for sure yeah and I was gonna say something you know %HESITATION some people may perceive kind of growing up in a in a %HESITATION with a name why working class environment or you know having parents from may %HESITATION from a foreign country they might see that as a way you know as a as a reason to hold them back from what they from what from what they want to achieve did you ever feel that way or how did your mind around that is really interesting because I never thought it would hold me back at Seoul %HESITATION say R. I. A.’s born and raised west London council estate out bringing people on the state you know you very much let me you know I Asian people black people white people Chinese people also serve people unexpected mixes at divested today %HESITATION school exactly the same you know I very very die fast %HESITATION because we’re in London you know a forty percent of people in London are from black and ethnic minority backgrounds bots I’m at the same time in my career I’ve see different industries have different I’m it did different people say you know if what’s in reach out very diverse in retail I’ve what’s in you know the digital space you know I was I’m is on for a while ferry drive us again I’m currently in property not site I pass so you for me I think where you’re asking the question did I realize that you know a my background was different to to have an impact on who I am and what I do yes up to a certain point I’m in property I’m sorry you know being in these other environments you kind of don’t think you see people you know %HESITATION the CIA station okay you don’t even think about it but then when you’re in a space where actually you all one of the minorities that’s when you realize it and then you start to think okay I am a minority and actually there aren’t any people like me who all at a senior level waltz what can I do about set or U. K. what can I do about it %HESITATION I can’t do anything about it these two perspectives of of what you can say because although you don’t know all I know I can tell you that although I’m no all %HESITATION I don’t have a role model in Asian woman no you know there are some Asian men bat that that you need to talk about top level I didn’t have that role model in my what pace but I do have women who all role models in my what pace and it shows you have men who have characteristics the I actually really like that I think yes I’d like that cat that you’re giving to your team members so I like that you know a level of professionalism not this thing so I can take away from different people and then I remember actually one time a lady stopped me and a friend of mine at what she’s become a friend %HESITATION stops may and she is from a an ashtray %HESITATION carribean background and she said to me and I see you all around the office %HESITATION stomping around I know when you’re coming %HESITATION but she said it’s really inspirational to see doing what you’re doing and I thought god like I can be an inspiration to some on that’s the difference you know that’s the difference if I say I can’t be bothered anymore like I keep knocking on this door it’s not life threatening I’m gonna leave then I’ll I then why as a business we lose that role model Figueira inmates on giving to other people and it’s not just makes any woman any you know a woman of color he is a man of color he was at that level that things I combi profits anymore you know I I think you have to judge on the basis of the environment that you’re in so if you keep knocking on that door and I actually think it’s edging you know I open little by little then stay but if you actually think it’s completely closed anything it’s not going to iPhone even the letterboxes glaze cut used then you know you need to rethink being in that company because because there are opportunities out there yeah and I think and when you like if you do leave a company and I thought it’s eventually going like it’s going to be their loss because they’re going to lose on the rich %HESITATION on the rich diversity off off off off off their of their staff and %HESITATION thirteen yeah everything without which which which that brings hundreds and I think that’s a really %HESITATION %HESITATION positive thing to be as diverse as we can because you get all these different ideas %HESITATION %HESITATION %HESITATION perspectives on you know it’s much easier to then %HESITATION it to %HESITATION to radio suppose %HESITATION %HESITATION understands how people feel in their own experience and we can all learn from each other yeah just having those really clear %HESITATION %HESITATION %HESITATION conversations yes I donate and definitely be open about things and and %HESITATION and what we’re experiencing what what what we feel like might %HESITATION well that could potentially %HESITATION %HESITATION hold us back from achieving things out you know we know we can but then there are things that would be it and and and %HESITATION certain what what in a certain way workplace environments which unfairly holds people back yeah I’m really lucky because I think the where I am in my in the business that I’m in %HESITATION is supportive of diverse today yeah I know it’s a in terms of %HESITATION change change can take time I’m Anne I think you have to pay it if you are a pass and he was trying to drive change in your business around divested today I think it’s important that you understand what you’re trying to achieve and I think it’s important to make sure that the leadership team all on your site because if they’re not on your side and it’s just lip service an intake box than all of your hard work is going to guide you into into the baton I’m if you put your name on something %HESITATION especially something as important as ray so all faith then you you need to make sure that it’s going to drive change and you know there’s lots of talk at the moment in terms of you know all businesses doing things just because and it has to start from the culture from the leadership %HESITATION and the best way to do it is to to commit get the business to commit to certain things that they want today up with you with the next ballot you know you might be get some external sapo that you can commit to is a business to say that she was going to set some metrics against this so every single level within the business we are going to do X. Y. and said in order to get more diverse city in order to get these metrics within going to you know change the recruitment process %HESITATION we guys change of training progress program we’re going to look at the communication that was sending out and the more open and transparent that the business can be about this commitment the more accountability there is and the more cats but it’s here there is more to monster is from the business in order for them to achieve what they’ve set out to do so it’s super important I think if you can put in nine something to make sure that it’s not all this we’re doing it just because it’s there it’s it looks like the right thing to do yeah no it has to be real yeah real change and you’ve mentioned them about you know being more creative say what you have to die fast %HESITATION you know what fools you then have more creativity and %HESITATION yet there’s a commercial value in having a die fast %HESITATION you know what fools because you get more ideas more days bringing more opportunities and then you know I it smoke commercially %HESITATION compassionate compassionately valuable but not only that I mean business is now all I’m seeing that clients that customers all wanting a Modi fast what fool so you look at you know I was looking at %HESITATION Sharon whites who I absolutely adore it’s going to help I do who I am but she is the the chair woman of a John Lewis and she’s done some amazing things across how accurate and %HESITATION you know she she starting from the inside look at the inside look at the business and then in a filter that out too to customize and I watched a video of has I think it was on the cheap and she said something about the television and film industry and she said in a B. B. C. R. %HESITATION they need to you know stay with the times in order to make sure that that customer is all seeing diverse city on screen and you know Netflix and these younger businesses that a you know a really super successful on making sure that they do that said the BBC has to compete on a diverse city level with these businesses otherwise they’re going to be like you know I bye bye BBC bet that’s not that’s not impossible yeah for sure %HESITATION but I suppose though they said like they they they should you would kind of think that %HESITATION a of business we want that you know yes just like what you said just to kind of take a boxes actually won’t know it’s act it’s it’s a good thing it’s it’s something that you would want to do hi while yeah I don’t want that you know yeah I I do agree with that I think say that they’ve all these echo chambers in business days where you know there is white stylin male white male instead I think it is %HESITATION and in a lot will white why do I need to with super successful why do we need to what I actually it’s you know imperative that you do because if you want to be here in you know ten twenty years time then you can have today yeah and it’s just kind of we also got used to kinda at a hearing like one voice you know yeah this kind of male white voices being very loud for a very long time yeah you know so yeah it’s definitely it’s time to hear some some other voices yeah just on you know just as much as we hear the the white male voice you know yeah a hundred percent I think I think say and I think it takes it takes commitment you know I hear people say to me I want change but I’m not willing to do the hard work and I’m not really annoys me I know that I shouldn’t let it know we made but it does because I think well then don’t complain it because if you want to do something about the minute you guys %HESITATION I’m in the S. you are accountable because you’re part of that change so if you’re not happy with how things are running a big Ron didn’t be part of the team that make sure that the people who are running it or doing it differently M. at and I I I’m not going to come to realize that recently because I was one of the people that was I. O. this is this is stupid I want to do things like this and then I was last night I would be politics so that kind of commitment and it’s hard work because a lot of the times people in the what paces so whatever environment they read it and have to do another job you know they have to do that all the job as well as driving another initiative but it just depends on how committed you how committed you feel you can be tackles mmhm but M. do you also feel that you know it’s also the %HESITATION the responsibility of those in charge as well to take on that because rather than just %HESITATION leave it to to those who are trying to add to fight not because if you know what I mean it’s almost like %HESITATION like I feel like the you know we kind of broadly very broadly kind of speak about like the the idea of the the white man surely it’s his collective response ability to come to you know take a while to be to be %HESITATION %HESITATION %HESITATION accountable for the roles that they collectively play robin yeah expecting those who have been %HESITATION like whose voices have been suppressed like is up to them to their %HESITATION you know hear me you know yeah like well this unit kind of maybe be the the %HESITATION the other way around yeah because they’re in though and they’re there in those high up up up put there in the high up %HESITATION positions they have the power yeah I see I think that’s a really good point important point and I think that you’re right %HESITATION I’m not saying that we should alleviate %HESITATION responsibility from people who are leading I think the latest to have responsibility ultimately for this yeah %HESITATION but while I have seen not just in the business that I’m in but in other businesses from my friends and people that I speak to is that there’s a lot of uncertainty around wall should be Donald could be done so it’s a bit like you need the support and the kind of our investment from thought leadership team and that investment can lead to you know read external pass and supporting you because if you don’t know what you’re doing then you need the external expertise but then you’ve got the voice of actually someone who’s in it he understands what’s happening or who’s got the aim of of the people who might be too scared to come forward to then what quase factory to help drive things forward so what was saying there was this collaborative the assets from people that isn’t one sided because if you did have one site then you would have this whole leadership saying he want she don’t understand what’s going on on the ground and how it’s impacting people making decisions that impact these people but then they guy %HESITATION why did you do it like this service you need everyone working together %HESITATION now this responsibility thing is a massive thing because it site people on the ground to light I don’t know how to do this why you ask me to do this I’m not an expert and then that’s why you need to expand his tight today you know a got that kind of gravitas got that presence to sites this leadership team this is wrong this is what needs to change and this is how I advise you to do it so it’s separate it’s everything and then you’ve got the leadership team that probably died this is a big investment you you know you’ve got to be able to save this is why we think this is the right thing today with this investment because if you die and then you’re gonna lose X. amount of people who will go to these companies all drive us and you can have to end up spending more money anyway so I invest is that you can keep these talented people in your business %HESITATION yes Sir I think it’s there’s no magic formula I think each business is different and I’m by no means any expect this is just from my experiences of what I’m saying at the moment and people that I’m speaking to I feel that this is on such entity this is kind of push for you we want things to change and then we need this whole kind of ex expertise you know if someone a business or even who’s done something like this before that can say you know this works try this mmhm yeah that’s great and %HESITATION but also what you said as well kind of how you %HESITATION hence fired your %HESITATION %HESITATION colleagues as well I think those things are %HESITATION VDM important too because you had that %HESITATION %HESITATION confidence in yourself to cut to the like %HESITATION to go for the roles that you want to try to break down that door yeah so it does take %HESITATION %HESITATION people like you as well to have that courage mmhm and to inspire some others and to show them dark if I can do this you know you can do this right we can all do this yeah definitely I think that you know if I look back to %HESITATION five yes guy when my confidence was not a real live I couldn’t have said see that now I would be doing what I’m doing now just that internal dialogue the I’m saying to myself you know every day you can say this this is what you’re going to achieve today you know just that kind of confidence of internally speaking to myself has had an impact on how I achieve things on a day to day basis say in terms of breaking down tools I think that it starts with in a from what you’re saying to yourself and what you think you want to achieve now I haven’t always good I five years ago I would have said you know I’m gonna be in a trying to try trying to drive with with a group of people in Iraq a race and faith initiative I would have said that I know you wide eyed me like how could I if you nee but you kind of find yourself in these situations why if you’re not going to do it and who the hell is going to do it %HESITATION and not she feels strongly enough to do something that you’re going to put yourself out then to do it because it’s the path as the coals is bigger than yourself and so you think well I’m going to do it because it’s not about me anymore but you know I five years ago is about me standing up in front of people doing a presentation will they like me will light you know what you know but I would I. six seats will they see you know you help me with the promotion will this help me %HESITATION gain popularity you know now it’s light while if I am who I am who I am who I am which is what I thought no always says to me you know that you are who you are you can’t really help how other people feel about you you’ve got to just feel good about yourself insights %HESITATION and make sure that that works for you and if it does what few great if it doesn’t try and figure out why not %HESITATION unsaved intensify contemporary is I think that I’ve had to put myself out there how to make myself as cheap it sometimes %HESITATION but Latin lessons from from that man so if I was to say like let’s say there was a %HESITATION young %HESITATION women going through the same kind of experiences that that that you were going through %HESITATION what would your advice be to her like you know when you when you have all these you have these dreams but then at the same time you feel like you have all this self doubt I like what what would you advise us okay it’s like where’s a good place to to %HESITATION start it’s hard isn’t it yeah because I think that they say many things I’m I think if there was a young girl he was %HESITATION he was like may that safe I was talking to my younger self I would say I figure out what you want yes over and be clear on yeah not just like what you want also why you want it yet the the Simon Sinek long time and %HESITATION why yes say what you want something what she wants I’m and how do you think you can get that and you know I remember one of my fast speeches at at Toastmasters which is the ice breaker speech where we talk for five minutes on ourselves and I think that you know I said that I like making lists the black face today I have like a trailer listed but it’s important because if you understand what you want yeah why don’t you say why you want something and you kind of can figure out the steps of how to get that then you’ve got your pad isn’t it not the plan because if say your fuel purposes all I want to get ready good job you know I’m gonna get really good job to support my family to be able to get out of the situation I’m in today %HESITATION and live the life so I want to live you know I thought that the Pappas is %HESITATION two kids consistently so you have people who have pap pap pap Tessie sy my purpose is to help people okay fair enough that show purpose but if your purpose is at stake I want to help myself I’m gonna get out of the situation I’m in so I can help the people around me %HESITATION and live the life I want to live than thought thought is a really good purpose for you to understand what you need to do next so I want to have a really good caress so I can help have that off I want so I can help the people around me okay so what kind of crazy one what skills do you need for that career you know how can you get those scales he can help you with those skills in a can you speak to someone so you don’t have any money can you speak to someone and say can I get some experience you know just yesterday I contacted my plumber who has been my promise for ten years who I absolutely trust and I lost him if he could support someone who I know he’s been made redundant and help them for a week to get some plumbing skills you know it’s it’s okay that person must be a plumber okay they K. a week’s free experience for you yes the comic as a free help about this person is starting from scratch so it’s what kind of small things can you do to get to where you want to get to it and I honestly do you think you need to hi tech how he writes it out so that you’ve got it written down so that you can refer to any model or fast to it for you know six months but you can look back in guy hi that’s why I said I was going today that is where I am today what’s gone wrong once I didn’t know you know I mean it is it’s written down and because because in hit it is all a bit further a mass citizen and missile a bit of a mess sometimes you’ve got to clarify what it is you want to weigh in in in your head and writing things down can help yeah I completely agree definitely it really does help to write things down but I am also you might find hello well actually I’m not really clear on you know to have all these like I’m the kind of person %HESITATION I want to do this so you have lots of different ideas so how would you start to get clear on %HESITATION on what it is like to find out what it is that you actually want to do because you’re like you know we also have lots of different ideas things are not not merely said we want to do and yeah I think it’s really halt so if I look at my career I wouldn’t have said to the you know if the I was I would be doing while I’m doing so I work in customer experience %HESITATION you know waiting public speaking coaching you know we catch people I’m sorry my point is that I think you need to find out what it is you think you’re good at what it is you enjoy what it is you would like today I’m and it’s not the you have to say pin box all the time because you know a opportunities don’t always come to everyone and people who do you get to do what they do and they really love it and get paid you know really well really really you know you’re fortunate and hardworking and whatever the situation is is is it in a manner that they’ve landed in this place but it’s really being realistic it’s being realistic it’s looking at your skill set looking at what you enjoy doing and looking at the opportunities around you to get to what you want to today in the US you know my my wife is speaking to people in a speech to different people contact people on linkedin you know I you’d be surprised about the amount of people I’ve contacted on linkedin who’ve been willing to help me have been willing to say yes I’ll give you an hour of my time to two to three days and even if you com find anyone he might you know be a pen to to giving you time they might be able to recommend someone else to you he might be able to support you %HESITATION and you might want to find yourself mental you know someone who can help you a lot of people tend not to tie to mental because they feel like it’s a responsibility so maybe just have a casual chat with some you know someone who you respect and admire you know once a cool to have a coffee keep yourself on track with them I’m and just make it really casual rather than a formal mental mentor and mentee relationship yeah so it’s amazing it’s really really really good advice I just one thing out also is %HESITATION you said that the importance of being able to reach out to %HESITATION well I think that’s that’s so key but then a lot of people and I think probably maybe yourself at one point kind of you know you also need to have the confidence to reach out to those people because I know with myself sometimes I think so I don’t really wanna misses this person I don’t know it’s like they’re not going to have to you know you have all this kind of self taught although that they’re not going to want to talk to me you know yeah so how so can can you talk to me a bit about how how to get the confidence to reach out to people yeah the are you are you do I have to I mean I it’s different for me I think because I’m more like what do I want to achieve at the end of this I’m sorry what seven example if this is I’ve seen them see how many times has done essentially I’ve seen a job that it’s been advertised before I know I’ve gone okay this is the company name this job not fertilized I’m not going to go through the normal rate and apply for this job I’m gonna go on linkedin contact the person who runs the business or it might not be might be not the department heads inside I’ve seen this job I’ve got this experience can we have a coffee type thing I didn’t see %HESITATION it’s what’s in my favor save that person has been contacted may well then I’ve contacted the recruitment company if not passed on linkedin hasn’t contacted me and I said yeah I’ve contact I’ve seen this job I contacted this person on linkedin and I’m just waiting for them to get back to me and then not recruitment companies that we collect on three straight away and let’s contact the company because then you get you know Hey they’re like oh we face she’s contacted the company and they want to make sure that that that that dating with the company in the right way but that’s because I had that experience on that level but I always put the faith that you something if you don’t have the experience and you are unsure what to do when to contact people I think you do need to go in with a bit of a strategy which is to mate which bay contacting them in the best way that you can %HESITATION linkedin is quite hard because it’s quite impasse Noel and people do get a lot of linkedin requests I’ve been quite lucky with mine at so I would see if you could find a way of speaking to them if you cast and I know that sweetie halt but %HESITATION if no alt than sending the Millington message %HESITATION sending them a message to that company with a bit of background about yourself what do you want to get out of that relationship you know maybe maybe it’s not even asking for relationship at that stage maybe just a bit about you you about I’m you know I’m in this position I really admire what you J. I want to gain skills when they’re so just wondered if we can have a quick coffee for half an hour %HESITATION over chat for half an hour with everything being factual now it’s easier for people to commit to not now because they don’t have to go anywhere is a quick si nanay %HESITATION and I think just think about what you want to block why you want to do what you’re doing fact connection with that personal help you get to where you want to get to M. you’re protected because you don’t even have to meet that person face to face it’s all the same so you you know now it’s time to do it okay for and and try it and see if it works in the more you do it it’s the serial cat not so true and I think what really comes across to me from what you’re saying the importance of like being like super %HESITATION proactive like you can’t just kind of have this like a dream or idea and just like sit back and kind of hope for the best yeah you really need to grab each chance you have and I go for it hundreds sent me my system a complete opposite flight that yeah my dad when a young kid but I like would you like ten pounds you know and I but yes some of the ten pounds my sister and I doubt it’s kind of got that money you know I mean it’s not we were completely opposite in terms of the opportunities that we would take so you %HESITATION I would say you know I take every opportunity that comes your way if you think it’s a good opportunity you know judge it but take in I think it’s good for what you want to achieve and you know a case back to a higher purpose than day for it I’m but go out there to find those opportunities you know also people for things I’m sorry but I have Austin I’ve lost for pay rises of office for the job title change I’ve also full of the things I won’t %HESITATION and I’ve been knocked down you know I I allow you to times all right you know and then the not my judgment I cast but not back they said no I do I want to stay in this place also I want to cry although other opportunities out there for me %HESITATION is this opportunity while sticking with because it’s going to help me get to where I want to get to in the long time so sometimes you don’t get what you want straightaway batch date it might take two or three years for you to get what you want to get in that company it might mean that you need to gain more skills in order to get to what you want to get to a bit but I forget learning skills is a value in itself because that’s been process because they skills help you to get to the next level and then to the next level if that’s what you want mmhm yeah that’s so true and like and and then with with what you said about yeah you might try for things you might go for it and it might be a no but you have to keep going yeah I understand why that night was a knife yeah you know I why is that no no way is it because I need to get better at certain things will tell me what that is because then all you know a guy who I work on it if that’s what you want today %HESITATION and you always going to be tested is this what I really want is discouraged right correct me I’m I could do this Carrera I’m on another user test there were tests to unite all you guys get to where you want to get to and what you gonna do with that night and I I just think every time I get a nice that it made me work harder it makes me wanna Holla and makes me perform that song %HESITATION and sometimes I’ve taken nice enough just gone fucking honest I had one guy at night you’ll you’ll not less it you’re not laughing at you %HESITATION and I hope I’ve made the right decisions in fact I know I’ve made the right decisions because the business is what set night those businesses offend not been very successful %HESITATION and I and I actually think what you were saying I know about leadership the integrity of leadership and the people around J. is so important because if you don’t believe in you’ll your boss will you tape leaving not a full leadership of the business then I would read a question why why you would stay in that price because that has an impact on on U. AA because it then cascades down to your integrity you may not know it but it will %HESITATION skate down onto your decision making saya I would say in the places where my bosses haven’t been good leaders of the places where I’ve gone I’m not staying you know what that totally a hundred percent I completely agree with him though US president I’m site now I just to %HESITATION because we talk so quite a bit about you know your your workplace but now you’re also branching off and to do %HESITATION public speaking coaching as well I am so what’s been the inspiration behind I am I imagine it’s like you know the the experience of having being scared to %HESITATION to present in front of people or to to speak to people who are in %HESITATION in up in in the store today and then now you kind of have you have you have you have the confidence now yeah to be able to do that yeah I T. is a growing confidence that easy it’s not you know I I know I you know I all wow yeah I’m gonna make you us doll you know it’s not that it’s it is very very soft so and I think the one of the things I’ve realized is that for people I’ve seen who are successful are kind of in my head I’ve gone why them why not may and then I thought I can do that I can do what she’s doing and there’s nothing that is stopping me apart from what’s up here and so I’ve realized three speaking to people about public speaking and that barriers it all starts with what’s in here and my the reason why I started the public speaking businesses because I know I thought walk we’ve been very is say the journey that we’ve been three the practice the the pressure of having to do a speech show %HESITATION the excitement all of during a speech in it being a success is something that can be learned it’s something that can be practiced in people that need to be stuck in a corner feeling like they have to put up with stuff because they don’t have to put up with it they can they can get out of that corner that I stuck it in really really develop themselves in %HESITATION starts with Watson you know it’s not communication that internal dialogue thought than it needs to Shastriji permeate through your whole body and through everything that you day %HESITATION and that funding ex I want to help people and I know you what we’ve done with people say fox is waiting or anything to get that is helping people definitely definitely and I think what you what you said there’s well like yeah it has to start in your mind but it’s not only her like what you what you say to yourself is actually how you show up how you %HESITATION behave like yeah that’s like the real key yeah I have to actually do the work you have to do the work you have to be committed it’s because it’s you know this whole thing of tenant wants monster presentation the next day the presentation it was a success but she was happening ninety percent of all died all his impromptu speaking with people what’s the perception of people when you’re speaking with people on your day to day %HESITATION and this whole thing of showing up I think he’s sepa yes it’s important but show up and be your authentic self you know it be who you want to be that’s my V. eight might not be everyone’s BA B. B. he want to be M. and I was talking about this with Trevor my fiance last night that we as two individuals people of color in environments where there is mainly %HESITATION you know what white white male people running the show we’d have to not conform but we’ve had to really be considered in the way that we approach things so we’ve had to you know there’s been times where I’ve you know much more relaxed in the way that I try to walk now because all business coach the dress code has %HESITATION changed but you know when you walk in a corporate environment you’re in these kind of stiff dresses you know it’s not who you really all it’s you’re wearing this kind of how a kind of outfit in order to be seen in a room %HESITATION if that is full of men or to have a voice you know see you kind of have to and you have to %HESITATION have a balance of what’s right for you in the environment that you’re in and ready be authentic to yourself so you you know I was saying to the other day that in my free six state review one of the feedback as one of the pieces of feedback was and is gonna rain strong brand but I think she needs to consider how she speaks to two senior people sometimes which is fine I to get it we do have to make sure that when you’re speaking to different people you’re adapting to you know who I all that disco use whatever that is but I don’t wanna lose myself and I’d rather be myself than then be someone else %HESITATION I don’t draw the lease stock opportunity for promotion if it means I have to be someone else a hundred percent yeah I completely agree with you definitely you have to be true to yourself yes so %HESITATION and I don’t think that’s what they was saying really maybe it was more about my communication rather than you know trying to change myself but I do think that if you’re not yourself in your communication even and yes I think we know we need to change your communication depending on who our audience is but I fit the if you do too much of that are you then lose you your %HESITATION sense of being comfortable with yourself if you lose your sense of being comfortable with yourself illegal confidence if you lose your confidence people might believe in what you’re saying because you I believe in what you’re saying so I I feel so connected him that’s really powerful and so so true %HESITATION well why we’ve had such a great conversation with you can tell he’s so much more as a really really great topics but %HESITATION yeah our well it’s time to wrap up now and %HESITATION %HESITATION just I see like my %HESITATION questions I ask every guest at the end and %HESITATION so what have been like some of the key of practices that have help you to %HESITATION to overcome challenges and attained success in I think my key practices ought to I believe in my drive safe drive for may’s rate important say I I really believe in and commitment intensive saying why do I say I’m going today I’m safe to me at an example of living that in practice is really getting the job done do you know I mean two hundred and fifty percent of my at capability so why I don’t shy away from what I roll my sleeves up you know I am I could pay someone to go into dye my mom and dad have for example but I will get into that myself because I’m committed to my relationship with them I want them to have nice you know I will make sure I get into that well my system okay do that you know I but it’s that kind of seeing things through to the end if you say you’re going to do something get it done %HESITATION I need a name once a robot like you know you wake up in the morning good I %HESITATION how company both I come before but today you know right but it’s not sense of what’s going to help you get to where you want to get to have the off days but get back on track as quickly as she can I’m so you yeah I get stuff done with your drive say keep it dry fakers just drive his old again we start talking about this the United this mental stuff say you know if you feel that you’re falling off of your your plan %HESITATION off track with your plan okay back to alas that drive is and for me it’s Najib if meditation meditation for me you know it was something that someone else did in some really nice field somewhere %HESITATION but it’s you know a couple of minutes every day I wake up deep breathing really really simple meditation technique you could do in the shower you could do on the train at so many that just helps me to feel grounded %HESITATION so that’s a simple practice that I do every day and %HESITATION helps me with my drive and then to get things done I’m I’m I would say the my other point in times of how I. chief things is talking to people because it’s not just about me it’s about the people around me getting people’s opinions of what’s right what’s wrong like I have been in the past %HESITATION it queue to just getting things done on my own you know and and you know I’m right I’m right you know but listening to people and saying what they think is is that the you know what’s the right way if that it in that perspective because you get more days and you get more people to say this is what would work and then you get you get betta a better outcome that way M. ma’am no sounds really great and %HESITATION what do you value most and how do you put it into practice in terms of materialistic things old thought well mind you so something like you know my idea behind the the question is like we have these %HESITATION values like a love %HESITATION %HESITATION coverage in %HESITATION integrity you know so well I want to know is like instead of having them as a conceptual ideas how to actually live them in practice so like what are the like the values that you would reach to you know keep it going yeah I mean how how would you practice those I think that mine move everything for me bows down to a to my relationships with my family especially I’m and I think that for make commitment at love I’m in cash every important to me and I lift weights and practice by making sure all fat I what I can always leave them and try to sometimes I you know I finish work re delay and I meant to be getting to see my family and I’ve been like really sorry I’m gonna have to see another day because of how to you know to do this now but I try not to do that obviously now with me working from home most of the time I’m not having to data box %HESITATION and I found it more productive to be a hot too behind so I have more time to get stuff done but it’s being committed to again what you say you’re going to decide I want to make sure every week I see my family go elderly parents I try and see them twice a week and I’m gonna make sure the I. D. that %HESITATION seven example of that is today we call social will protect small says no I’m not going on that sexual because I’m taking my mom out you know I and that is my commitment and my love my cat so I show you in practice by splitting my time in a way that makes it work full well I want to achieve but %HESITATION say being able to still see my my family as often as I can and enjoying time with them %HESITATION yes I said that and it you know and I study practices you know caring for the people around me I guess you know how are you what’s going on you know I having you might always be able to help but she’s showing that you care I think is really important I think it will starts with relationships mmhm yeah I agree with you a hundred percent that relationships are K. I think there’s a really good quote something like M. the quality of your life is determined by the quality of your relationships yeah that’s a really good quite it’s funny isn’t it because you know if we think back %HESITATION I mean I tonight what you think you hear about this but I kind of feel the there was this kind of sense in the eighties or nineties why you know a boss needed to be a certain way you know these horrible balls but that doesn’t work anymore it doesn’t what with relationships any relationship that you have %HESITATION stalls with Cavan empathy %HESITATION and that’s what will make you successful because people will buy into years a pass and they went by into a product to what you’re sending to them it’s who you all I’m and the same full you know the relationships I kind of struggle in the past with you know I do I gave yeah if you if your boss is calling %HESITATION your mom scolding which finds you on so if you’ve got the fines yeah because you guys are quite lucky doing well which one do you want seven pasta you know it would have been my boss actually now it’s it’s my mom you know I found it and I know that sounds really weird but for me that’s what’s important to me soon %HESITATION and I’m not drive that drives me to to kind of do I do mmhm amazing I really love it thank you so much Anna thanksgiving great now if someone would like to find out a bit more about what you do %HESITATION where is the best place to find you well that’s a good question %HESITATION I think that the best place to find to me would just be on Instagram separates shine bright speaking this is the handle yeah I’m sorry yeah right sure to include all of your links and stuff thank you thank you says it’s been right yeah I yeah thank you so much and I can’t wait to see %HESITATION what more and you’ll have in store for us we’ll have you back on to here %HESITATION what’s coming up next in your journey yeah later on I can T. my S. seven minute ABS workout yeah the next time if prudent thank you so much and I think he %HESITATION thank you so much for I’m listening %HESITATION if you enjoy this podcast please remember to subscribe and if you think that this episode %HESITATION would be beneficial for someone %HESITATION please make sure to share with your friends otherwise %HESITATION I’ll catch you next time